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Elizabeth Warren Wins

by: Rob "EaBo Clipper" Eno

Tue Nov 06, 2012 at 21:51:49 PM EST


Elizabeth Warren has won the U.S. Senate seat.
Rob "EaBo Clipper" Eno :: Elizabeth Warren Wins
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Republicans need to learn GOTV in MA. (0.00 / 0)


Vir bonus, dicendi peritus  

Republican (3.33 / 3)
Need to cut the crap sideshow and get serious.  Brown lost this thing when he went on the attacks on non-issues, ran from his record, and didn't mind the Indys and disillusioned Dems that voted for him in 2010.

I also think this race seriously hurt what was a prospective chance at the Governors office in the future.  Never say never, but this was a very poorly run campaign compared to last.

Live by the stupid attacks, die by the stupid, childish attacks.  Works in Georgia, not in MA.  


[ Parent ]
Bullshit (0.00 / 0)
Brown lost because democrats are basically tribal by nature (pun not intended, but apt).

The "hold your nose and vote for Tierney" meme over at the kiddie table is evidence enough of that.

The election of a vacuous, unaccomplished carpetbagger based solely on name recognition is evidence enough of that.


[ Parent ]
By calling a 17 yr resident of MA... (0.00 / 0)
"a carpetbagger" illustrates your complete detachment from reality, which the rest of your comment also represents.

[ Parent ]
But to be fair... (0.00 / 0)
she didn't seem to have much of a connection to her community here.  Nor did she have any connection to the Native American community that was an important part of her identity.  For someone running for Senate, that's very unusual.  Brown's mistake was in relying way too much on this stuff.  The booing of his supporters when he mentioned Warren's name last night reflected the intense negativity of his campaign.

[ Parent ]
What does connection to the community mean? (0.00 / 0)


---
"That it ceased to exist, I'll grant you, but whether or not it failed cannot be definitively said." - Metropolitan (1990)


[ Parent ]
Meaning... (0.00 / 0)
if I move to Texas and get a professorship at UTSA...that doesn't make me a Texan.

"I acknowledge having racist and classist and sexist feelings of white male superiority." -John Howard

[ Parent ]
agreed (4.00 / 1)
A little of the fake indian stuff would have been OK - once that became the entire campaign it was over.  He needed to make a case for what he believed in - everyone knew who she was and what she had done.  They just didn't care.  She offered a shared vision with Obama which, whether we like it or not, the majority of the state agrees with... Why would you pick the bipartisan when you can have the real thing.

As a state party we need to offer something other than democrat-lite / bipartisan.  I had the same impression about the local senate races - the candidates offered to be better at bringing home the local aid instead of fundamentally asking why we have this patronage system to begin with.  Democrats are winning because they have realized this - don't hide from who you are go out and fight for it.  Make the other guy look bad for not compromising with you don't offer to be the one to give in...  

I don't know if libertarian is the right place but at some point I think we need to come up with an alternate brand to republican - especially in Massachusetts.  It has become too tied into the social conservative movement in the country.  It is impossible to get anywhere in this state as a republican - too easy to bring up the Todd Akin bogeyman anytime you get any traction.  I think a serious attempt at a party that stood for fiscal conservatism but not evangelical conservatism could gain a following - and not just at the fringes.  We just can't start by taking it to the extreme and offering a vision of immediately blowing up the existing system.  

Just as the democrats realized they can't come in the front door with single payer healthcare and need to take over/break the legacy system first we need to do the same.  If the tax code sucks - don't offer a plan that eliminates it completely - that is easily written off as extremism.  Offer a plan that begins by simplifying it - but without the baggage of abortion/gay marriage/etc. Once you are in and have proven that your ideas work you can make bigger changes.  


[ Parent ]
Ugh. (0.00 / 0)
Warren over Brown?
Kennedy over Bielat?
Teirney leading Tisei?

This state truly is a cesspool.


On the plus side... (0.00 / 0)
I think I won the prediction thread.

---
"That it ceased to exist, I'll grant you, but whether or not it failed cannot be definitively said." - Metropolitan (1990)


[ Parent ]
Flush Twice (0.00 / 0)
It's a long way to Cambridge.

[ Parent ]
GOTV or else (0.00 / 0)
There is no Republican organization at the local level in this state - the Democrats in our town were checking voting lists and calling people - the republicans nothing.

..... (0.00 / 0)
I would suggest there is no Republican Organization at the state level either.  With a few rare exceptions.

Richard A. Jolitz

Once, and future, candidate


 


[ Parent ]
Where is the technology ? (5.00 / 1)
Brown had a lot of cash - why was it not spent on some GOTV technology and workers ?

No canvasing in my town - I held signs on my own motivation.


[ Parent ]
Eric Fehrnstrom (5.00 / 1)
Can we please ditch this guy?

---
"That it ceased to exist, I'll grant you, but whether or not it failed cannot be definitively said." - Metropolitan (1990)


People saying GOTV are fooling themselves. (4.00 / 1)
Brown was an incumbent and he ran a shitty campaign. Everyone attached to it should be out of MA politics.

---
"That it ceased to exist, I'll grant you, but whether or not it failed cannot be definitively said." - Metropolitan (1990)


Another bad year (0.00 / 0)
This state is owned by the unions, if it isn't it certainly seems that way.  
I didn't watch Scott's campaign that much because Warren was a national laughingstock, now MA is once again.

Time for Republicans not to blame each other (5.00 / 2)
There really was little chance in this state for Romney to do well enough to allow Scott to win. The wonder is that Tisei would have won if it had not been for Fishman, and no Republican is to blame for him. I hereby resign from "libertarian" too.  

Were there a lot of libertarians rallying behind Fishman? (0.00 / 0)
I find it hard to believe any libertarian wouldn't have voted for Tisei, who is himself a libertarian.

[ Parent ]
Most Likely Ron Paul supporters. (4.67 / 3)
The debacle that occurred at the Caucus alienated a good deal of libertarian-mind republicans in the 6th district.

After their votes for delegates were essentially invalidated, I imagine they had a bad taste in the mouth and probably voted for Fishman.

The GOP's actions in that instance really ended up coming back to bite them.  We had opportunity to pull these voters into the party, instead we further eroded our numbers.


[ Parent ]
Even so, there aren't that many. (0.00 / 0)
A far bigger group are Democrats who just can't bring themselves to vote for a Republican.

I think it's a mistake to assume Fishman's voters would have done anything other than blank the race had he not been in it.  One thing third party candidates do is allow us to count some of the ballots that otherwise would have been blank.


[ Parent ]
Hard to believe,indeed (5.00 / 2)
There's a type of libertarian who needs perfection or he has to screw things up for all of us. As of this morning's paper, Tierney had $173,590 votes, Tisei 169,454, and Third Party candidate Libertarian Fishman 16,166. Certainly there aren't 16,000 libertarians in the 6th (or MA), so there were other factors like anti-gay bigotry, Democrats who didn't want to vote for either Tierney or any Republican, and maybe Independents who mistook Fishman for NOTA.  Regardless, if he hadn't been on the ballot, Tisei would have won and yes, we'd have the closest thing to a libertarian in Congress from the 6th.

[ Parent ]
Your analysis is spot-on, (0.00 / 0)
but it doesn't sound like those are voters who were inclined to vote for Tisei under any circumstance.

If Tisei did lose the votes of libertarians who might have otherwise voted for him, then he made a monumental blunder by not pitching to them directly.  There really wasn't any daylight between Tisei and Fishman, so it wouldn't have been a hard case to make.


[ Parent ]
The problem with MA6... (0.00 / 0)
All the polls were wrong because they never included Dan Fishman.  It isn't Dan Fishman's fault everyone pretended it was a two person race with Tisei in the lead when that wasn't the case at all.

---
"That it ceased to exist, I'll grant you, but whether or not it failed cannot be definitively said." - Metropolitan (1990)


[ Parent ]
libertarian (0.00 / 0)
I agree no more voting  libertarian

[ Parent ]
At a certain point… (0.00 / 0)
The negativity was just over the top and hurt Brown with women voters.  And it probably didn't help that Brown said he most admires Scalia and that he voted against Kagan for a reason nobody really believes.

Also doesn't help when... (5.00 / 4)
You have to repeatedly apologize for other members of your party when they say things about rape.

---
"That it ceased to exist, I'll grant you, but whether or not it failed cannot be definitively said." - Metropolitan (1990)


[ Parent ]
Ugh ... (5.00 / 1)
It just goes from bad to worse. Again the moderates lose to the wild eyed fanatics. Even the Kennedy BOY comes up a winner in that cowpatch Massachusetts.
I avoided the prediction thread earlier because I kind of saw this coming but I didn't want to seem negative so...
I will now make a prediction ... the exodus will continue ... Viva Nicola and the Indian princess.
At least the GOP holds the house. Lets hope they didn't lose their spine.

I know a lot of you disagree with me on this but... (0.00 / 0)
I still say the GOP has troubles because it simply ISN'T conservative enough.

When you run a fake republican against a fake Indian...the fake Indian is going to win every time.

Scott Brown beat Coakley because she was perhaps the worst candidate in the history of bad candidates.  She should have "hammered" Brown.

Brown spent too much time pandering to women; trying to prove he's a "get along" kind of guy; apologizing for things he had nothing to do with.  At his core, he's a compromise artist.  The trouble with those, and Mitt displayed it too...by not going after Obama on Libya...is when you have your political enemy in your sights, you fail to pull the proverbial trigger.  Brown's case against Warren was dictated by the media, not by his principles.

Face it...he is who he said he would be....he's a "moderate", which translates to "more donkey than elephant".

I think the same thing hurt Tisei.  There is room for the Fishman's of the world because the GOP isn't conservative enough.

Just my 2 cents.  I've been saying this since I joined RMG.  Some of you disagree, but election results confirm my thoughts time and time again.


"Gee, I had no idea..."  Simple J. (Festus) Malarkey  


libertarian is not far right (0.00 / 0)
sort of blue/red

Brown lost because of Warren's good ground game and presidential coat tails.

Brown would have won if this was not a Presidential election.

The Tisei outcome is just sad  


[ Parent ]
How much of the MA electorate (0.00 / 0)
Counts themselves as "seriously" conservative?  Where are these magical voters hiding, waiting for the unicorn candidate?

I agree you can't run as a fake republican or fake conservative.  But we can realize our arguments are falling on deaf ears, and find new conservative arguments, new ideas, and new ways to confront 21st century America.

Marriage Equality is Conservative at it's core.  Romney-care was conservative at it's core.  Paying down debt (yes with revenue AND frugality) is conservative at it's core.

We have options.  We choose not to make the arguments, and have instead ceded them to a growing Democratic party.  We've severely put ourselves into a corner in a pursuit of purity that isn't very conservative in nature.  It's hampered our ability to adapt and connect with new demographics we sorely need.  


[ Parent ]
there are no unicorn conservatives (0.00 / 0)
MA GOP needs to adapt or fade away.

Brown won in my almost south coast town 2:1 and Romney won - which I find amazing.

The problem is the cities vs. the suburbs.  


[ Parent ]
roark... (0.00 / 0)
...I understand your point.  But "adapt" is a very generic word.  Adapt to what?

I believe that a more serious soul searching tells us that this is NOT a "center right country"...and not even "center left" country...but a LEFT WING country...for now.

The USA looks a lot like England did in the decade before Thatcher. What is worse... we have lost the young (if by a smaller margin than in 08) and that means they STILL are not getting it about the debt, unemployment, and their future.

The country is on the dole; the "have nots" have won. The majority of people in places like Massachusetts, Virginia, Ohio and Pennsylvania want a Shining City on the hill, but want it paid for by someone else. Too many people have accepted that it's okay to suck off their neighbors success.

Regarding the Presidential race...A liberal Republican lost to a Marxist Democrat. It's that simple.

Brown lost because he failed...he based his campaign on media talking points and not on the issues....he failed....because he pandered to women....he ran a piss poor campaign and the only one he has to blame is himself.

"Gee, I had no idea..."  Simple J. (Festus) Malarkey  


[ Parent ]
Ryan: (0.00 / 0)
"Marriage Equality" the way YOU may define it....homosexual marriage (or whatever you call it) is most certainly NOT a conservative value.

Word choice is very important.  "Marriage Equality" is a BS term used to gin up emotions to something that is a logical fallacy.  The vast majority of homosexuals don't desire "marriage"; rather, militant homosexual activists desire to use "same-sex marriage" as both a tool to normalize homosexual behaviors and as a weapon to tear down the institution of legitimate marriage.

You don't become MORE conservative, or appeal to more conservatives by adopting LESS conservative values.

Essentially what YOU are advocating is a wholesale takeover of the GOP by the moderate wing of the democrat party.

MARK LEVIN: We conservatives, we do not accept bipartisanship in the pursuit of tyranny. Period. We will not negotiate the terms of our economic and political servitude. Period. We will not abandon our child to a dark and bleak future. We will not accept a fate that is alien to the legacy we inherited from every single future generation in this country. We will not accept social engineering by politicians and bureaucrats who treat us like lab rats, rather than self-sufficient human beings. There are those in this country who choose tyranny over liberty. They do not speak for us, 57 million of us who voted against this yesterday, and they do not get to dictate to us under our Constitution.

We are the alternative. We will resist. We're not going to surrender to this. We will not be passive, we will not be compliant in our demise. We're not good losers, you better believe we're sore losers! A good loser is a loser forever. Now I hear we're called 'purists.' Conservatives are called purists. The very people who keep nominating moderates, now call us purists the way the left calls us purists. Yeah, things like liberty, and property rights, individual sovereignty, and the Constitution, and capitalism. We're purists now. And we have to hear this crap from conservatives, or pseudo-conservatives, Republicans.

http://www.realclearpolitics.c...

"Gee, I had no idea..."  Simple J. (Festus) Malarkey  


[ Parent ]
The (5.00 / 1)
institution of civil marriage is a conservative value.

I'm fine with other peoples religious definitions, but let them keep that to them selves, and their church.  

Bringing GBLT people into the fabric of our society with civil marriage is conservative.  Period.  It's a good thing, unless you like to selectively [s]read[/s] bible verses.  

And most young Conservatives agree.  The only question is how long it will take for the party to change, and if the current leaders will have to be cast aside before we get there.  


[ Parent ]



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